Jonathan Heathcote is a monetary advisor in the Research Department of the Federal Reserve Bank of Minneapolis. He co-authored the paper “A Macroeconomic Perspective on Stock Market Valuation Ratios,” which analyzes how free cash flow and declining labor share explain elevated stock valuations. He previously served as an economist in the International Finance Division of the Federal Reserve Board of Governors from 2006 to 2008.
It does seem generally true that the big theme both with financials and tech is this incredible ability to generate huge returns with fairly modest capital outlays… but for much of the 2000s the investment was in sort of like tangible… and now we’re switching to really like brick and mortar.
— Jonathan Heathcote
The question is like okay they’re still making a ton of money… but can investors expect the same level of returns that they’ve seen in the past if there’s this big switch in terms of strategic decision making in terms of capital outlays?
— Jonathan Heathcote
We realized that the kind of international gross asset positions have gotten really big and a lot of the decline in the net foreign asset was driven by the fact that foreigners had invested a lot in us equity markets.
— Jonathan Heathcote
One thing macroeconomists have been talking about for a long time for example is the fact that it looks like labor share of output has been drifting down over time… that’s gonna drive up valuations.
— Jonathan Heathcote
If you look at that ratio, the value of all the firms in the US relative to the total cash flow they’re generating… it doesn’t have like a long term drift… maybe prices are roughly where they… roughly within historical range compared to this ratio.
— Jonathan Heathcote
If you look at where it was say in 1980… that ratio of value to free cash flow is the same… we’re not wildly overvalued today.
— Jonathan Heathcote
If you look at the price earnings ratio it’s not like earnings haven’t grown they’ve grown pretty fast and they’ve grown pretty fast because the share of the output that’s going to workers has been going down and the share that’s going to owners of firms has.
— Jonathan Heathcote
If you look at the corporate sector… those wages and salaries have fallen by about eight percentage points since 1980… that’s a big change.
— Jonathan Heathcote
There has been a big shift with less income going to labor more income going either to capital or just as pure rents to the owners of firms.
— Jonathan Heathcote
The free cash flow measure is gonna be the same either way so I think that’s a nice thing about free cash flow it is just a measure of the income that’s left over after the firm’s paid all its bills and it doesn’t really matter whether you count those bills as a as an input cost or a capital expenditure.
— Jonathan Heathcote
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